Center for Security Policy President Frank Gaffney joined SiriusXM host Raheem Kassam on Wednesday’s Breitbart News Daily to talk about Tuesday’s terrorist attack in New York City.

Kassam commended Gaffney for saying in his own Secure Freedom Minute radio broadcast that it was “an attack not on New Yorkers, not on Americans, not on Westerners, but an attack on us.”

“It’s another assault on Western civilization, and all of us who have lived under it, who have prospered from it, who have – as we often do in this country – taken it for granted,” Gaffney told Kassam. “The point really was to tee up the second line, Raheem, which is that all other things being equal, this is going to happen to more of us. Take it to the bank.”

“The underlying point, which you understand better than just about anybody, is if we persist in doing what we have been doing, and the way I would briefly summarize that is ‘submitting,’ we’re going to find our enemies – and that’s who they are, these are not all Muslims to be clear, but the Muslims who embrace the totalitarian political-military-legal doctrine that they call sharia – are going to kill more of us,” Gaffney warned.

“Therefore, I think it is high time, and I know Breitbart does an outsize job of doing this, and I’m very grateful to you for being able to contribute to it week upon week, but to have an honest, thoughtful, and free speech-informed debate about submission, and whether we can safely continue to engage in it,” he said. “That’s partly what we have to discuss, not just the phenomenon but how we’re doing it, and why this enemy perceives this as a red cape to a bull, to come charging at us even more viciously in the future.”

Kassam asked if President Trump’s criticism of the “diversity visa” program that brought Uzbek terrorist Sayfullo Saipov into the United States could hasten the end of the program.

“Well, I pray so, Raheem,” Gaffney replied. “The term ‘submission’ of course, as you know, is the literal meaning of the word ‘Islam.’ Therefore, I’m not just pulling this out of thin air. I’m saying that’s what people – and many of them, yes, have come here under the diversity lottery. It’s not so much a lottery, it’s Russian roulette, for God’s sake! We don’t have a clue who those people are. But just because they come from parts of the world that are unrepresented or underrepresented, boom! Their lucky day is perhaps the loaded chamber in that revolver. It’s really bad for the rest of us.”

Gaffney cited Kassam’s book No Go Zones: How Sharia Law Is Coming to a Neighborhood Near You as chronicling examples of “submission of the worst kind happening in Europe and happening here.”

“What we have to be doing is revisiting all of the premises with the rest of the American people about what’s going on here, whether it is about immigration, and simply having an honest chat about whether importing more jihadists is a responsible thing to be doing,” he said. “If it’s not, then you have to get behind the sorts of things that President Trump has recommended.”

“Just yesterday, people were giving very short shrift – including John McCain and others who said, he said, ‘I haven’t even read the principles the president laid out as what he thought needed to be done in order to do a deal on DACA,’ one of which was ‘end this visa lottery.’ Well, it’s time again that we compelled people like John McCain and Democrats and others to read what the president is saying, and more to the point act on it,” he said.

“And also vetting of course, and also I would argue we have to be rigorous about the fact that if these multi-use facilities, they’re not simply houses of worship, they’re ‘cultural centers’ as they call them, they’re madrassas or schools in many cases, they’re places where community centers convene,” he added. “They’re also places oftentime where training, and certainly recruitment, for jihadism takes place. These are known as ‘mosques’ to most of us. These are places that need to be surveilled, and where that kind of activity is taking place, they need to be shut down.”

When Kassam called for the Islamic institutions that are spreading extremist ideology to be “bulldozed,” Gaffney said it was important to understand the “symbolic value” of such mosques and madrassas.

“The mosques are being built with the minarets higher than any church, for example,” he noted. “They’re in some cases being built on top of churches, or churches are being turned into mosques. This is why it was so infuriating when the sharia-adherent, the sharia supremacists in New York City were insisting – within, I think, yards of where this attack took place yesterday – that some of that hallowed ground of the World Trade Center area be turned into a mosque, a very tall mosque at that. It’s about symbolism.”

“Undoing that symbolism, showing that they’re not winning, showing that if they embrace this sharia program they must be put out of business, would be an incredibly symbolic and important gesture,” he said, recalling a study from several years ago that reported finding the trappings of “sharia supremacy,” and even sympathy for jihad, in 80 out of 100 mosques that were studied.

“Is that representative of all of these mosques across America, some 3,000 of them? Hard to say, but it’s a starting point for figuring it out, and what we need to do about it,” Gaffney said.

Breitbart News Daily airs on SiriusXM Patriot 125 weekdays from 6 a.m. to 9 a.m. Eastern.

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